***Official*** India in South Africa

Turbinator said:

What did he say, I think I missed it?

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Plenty of crap. I'll tell you tomorrow. Later.

adharcric said:

Plenty of crap. I'll tell you tomorrow. Later.

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Good morning.

Jono said:

Anyone else loving the sight of Ganguly sledging?

He's shown throughout his series that he badly wants to be out there, and actually gives a crap now. He's been made to earn his spot in the team, and even with his batting you can see it. Yes he's still woeful against the short ball (possibly worse than before), but the way he talks to himself and battles through is great. Great to see IMO.

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He still sucks against the short ball, but he is still scoring runs, and as long as that happens...the rest be damned.

http://content-usa.cricinfo.com/ausveng/content/current/story/275332.html

ECB board meets and discusses how to regain the ashes and do well in cricket. I bet Pawar has not had a single conversation to anyone regarding actual cricket. Let alone having a written plan to improve Indian cricket.

Jono said:

To be fair, and I do agree his injury has made it worse, but he is a pretty damn bad fielder. I complained during the CT a fair bit about it actually.

His batting pisses me off more though. His shot in that match vs. Aus in the DLF Cup ODI series in Malaysia pissed me off to no end. He just in general doesn't care, and it probably irritates me more because Arjun pumped him up as if he could bat, and for some weird reason I believed him.

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I'm not saying his fielding is good or even passable. Just that it is more noticable now because of his injury. Before the match, all the Indian fans were jumping for joy that he had been selected due to the hopelessness of Vikram Singh in the first two tests. Munaf is a bowler - and as far as I'm concerned, he is the third best paceman India have to choose from at this stage. If the pitch dictates then three quicks then he should play. He may be a poor fielder but Vikram Singh and RP Singh aren't great either. Irfan Pathan is better but it's not like he's Jonty Rhodes or anything and his bowling is complete rubbish at the moment. If I was Indian captain and Pathan was in my lineup, I probably wouldn't even bother bowling Pathan - it'd achieve nothing but runs.

Turbinator said:

Well, I guess Pathan would've added good fielding and 20-30 runs more than what Munaf added if he was picked. And it's not like Munaf has been very special with the ball.

Pathan and Karthik could've produced a good partnership, maybe.

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Has Duncan Fletcher logged into Turbinator's account by any chance? If you're going to pick Pathan based on batting on fielding, you might as well pick Kaif. He'd probably bowl as well as Pathan anyway and he certainly bats and fields a lot better.

Dravid said:

His fielding was never good. If Munaf gives 30 runs in 10 overs, he will cost another 25-30 runs for other bowlers.

We don't have any action until the end of the month. Teach munaf to field please. Otherwise I'm happy with two pacemen depending on the pitch.

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As I said, I'm claiming he is a good fielder or even a passable one - just that he isn't quite as bad when he's fit. I'd have no issues with two pacemen if the pitch dictated but I'd hate to see Patel dropped for Vikram Singh, RP Singh or Pathan just because his fielding was ordinary.

How good is Gagandeep Singh in the field?

Prince EWS said:

Has Duncan Fletcher logged into Turbinator's account by any chance? If you're going to pick Pathan based on batting on fielding, you might as well pick Kaif. He'd probably bowl as well as Pathan anyway and he certainly bats and fields a lot better.

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LOL!

Prince EWS said:

Has Duncan Fletcher logged into Turbinator's account by any chance? If you're going to pick Pathan based on batting on fielding, you might as well pick Kaif. He'd probably bowl as well as Pathan anyway and he certainly bats and fields a lot better.

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I've never seen Kaif bowl... and Pathan is by far a better bowler than Kaif, even if Kaif does bowl, I think you'de agree.

And I didn't really suggest the inclusion of Pathan in the Indian team over Munaf's, I was just laying out the match situation had Pathan been in the team instead of Munaf.

silentstriker said:

How good is Gagandeep Singh in the field?

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Does it really matter? I reckon I'm a better fielder than Munaf but I don't see myself getting the callup. If you really find fielding that important, drop Patel for Raina or Kaif. I'm sure we'll all agree that his role as third seamer is far more important than saving a few runs in the field though so that most certainly won't be happening. Trying to pick someone who can do both roles but not as well as other candidates is very Fletcher-esque really - does not yield good results.

Prince EWS said:

Does it really matter? I reckon I'm a better fielder than Munaf but I don't see myself getting the callup. If you really find fielding that important, drop Patel for Raina or Kaif. I'm sure we'll all agree that his role as third seamer is far more important than saving a few runs in the field though so that most certainly won't be happening. Trying to pick someone who can do both roles but not as well as other candidates is very Fletcher-esque really - does not yield good results.

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With that said, you still need to bat down to seven or eight, and Munaf does nothing in two sections of the game. That might be OK, but he didn't do much with bowling either so far. So he's like Giles with bowling and Monty with the fielding. Who does that help?

Also, Gagandeep Singh is doing so well in FC cricket, he needs a shot IMO anyway, regardless of Munaf.

silentstriker said:

With that said, you still need to bat down to seven or eight, and Munaf does nothing in two sections of the game. That might be OK, but he didn't do much with bowling either so far. So he's like Giles with bowling and Monty with the fielding. Who does that help?

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Why are you insulting Monty... ?

Anyway, not saying to get rid of Munaf. He's clearly hurt. But he needs to get his act together in the field. It was a disgrace that Karthik with full pads was outrunning him 2x.

Lost a bit of respect for some people in this thread to be honest. I can very much understand being angry at events, but the reactions of the seven-ball over sum it up for me. Miscounts of the balls in an over are not a rare event, and although this occasion had dramatic circumstances, it`s part of the human element of cricket.

I`m guilty of over-reacting more than a few times, like in the 2005 Ashes series, and generally everytime Bracken gets hit for a run. However umpires are not biased, and make mistakes with their decisions. But guess what? It evens out. Sometimes you will get decisions going your way, and how much better will it feel when you`ve taken the bad gracefully?

Statements like "Rauf should go to hell" really dissapoint the faith I have in humanity. He is a man doing his job, and if he screws up often enough, he loses his job and the money and status that go with it. I can not see why, those things in consideration, Rauf or any umpire or player or groundsperson would not do their job, something they`re talented about and passionate about, without doing it to the best of their ability. I understand people are not perfect, and can become complacent, which is frustrating when you have no power to change it. But by basing a person`s worth by their performance in a cricket match, you are degrading yourself.

We are grossly blessed people to be in a position to enjoy a game of cricket, more often than not howand when we want it, let alone having food, shelter and safety. Never forget the millions of people who would give it all just to have a few seconds of our lives.

silentstriker said:

So he's like Giles with bowling and Monty with the fielding. Who does that help?

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So you propose dropping him for.. Gareth Batty basically? Sub-Giles bowling with Giles-like batting and fielding.

Patel hasn't done badly enough with the ball to deserve being dropped IMO - especially considering he was carrying injury, and especially considering the other options. I haven't seen Gagandeep so I won't comment on him (although, just on a hunch, I have a feeling you haven't seen him either) but none of the other fast bowling options are better bowlers than Munaf, nor are they good enough batsmen or fielders to justify their place in the side based on those disciplines.

silentstriker said:

He still sucks against the short ball, but he is still scoring runs, and as long as that happens...the rest be damned.

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yes runs are all that matter..and sachin is probably only batsmen IND has who does not have much technical flaws, and he ain't doing much either so in the end runs are all that matter, key being consistent at getting them.
It would've been nice if SAF were 30/2 instead of 55/2, I say SAF will win with 5 wickets left...

Prince EWS said:

So you propose dropping him for.. Gareth Batty basically? Sub-Giles bowling with Giles-like batting and fielding.

Patel hasn't done badly enough with the ball to deserve being dropped IMO - especially considering he was carrying injury, and especially considering the other options. I haven't seen Gagandeep so I won't comment on him (although, just on a hunch, I have a feeling you haven't seen him either)

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Unfortunately, domestic games are not broadcast. I have to go on hearsay.

Prince EWS said:

I'm not saying his fielding is good or even passable. Just that it is more noticable now because of his injury. Before the match, all the Indian fans were jumping for joy that he had been selected due to the hopelessness of Vikram Singh in the first two tests. Munaf is a bowler - and as far as I'm concerned, he is the third best paceman India have to choose from at this stage. If the pitch dictates then three quicks then he should play. He may be a poor fielder but Vikram Singh and RP Singh aren't great either. Irfan Pathan is better but it's not like he's Jonty Rhodes or anything and his bowling is complete rubbish at the moment. If I was Indian captain and Pathan was in my lineup, I probably wouldn't even bother bowling Pathan - it'd achieve nothing but runs.



Has Duncan Fletcher logged into Turbinator's account by any chance? If you're going to pick Pathan based on batting on fielding, you might as well pick Kaif. He'd probably bowl as well as Pathan anyway and he certainly bats and fields a lot better.



As I said, I'm claiming he is a good fielder or even a passable one - just that he isn't quite as bad when he's fit. I'd have no issues with two pacemen if the pitch dictated but I'd hate to see Patel dropped for Vikram Singh, RP Singh or Pathan just because his fielding was ordinary.

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None of them are going to come back. We have a couple of more in domestic cricket that deserve a shot. tbf, I never really saw a diff from Munaf before this series, and now in fielding. Always slow, has the really gay through. He just seems like he doesn't even want to be out there.

silentstriker said:

Unfortunately, domestic games are not broadcast. I have to go on hearsay.

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This being my hunch. Always the chance you packed up your bags and went to the games I suppose. Either way, I my point about Munaf still stands. A sub-par fielding performance in a match which he was injured in is hardly grounds on which to drop a player for someone who is clearly an inferior bowler (Vikram), someone who is ridiculously out of form (Pathan) or someone who is yet to play international cricket (Gagandeep). If he bowled pies you'd have a point, but fielding.. bit harsh.

Prince EWS said:

Does it really matter? I reckon I'm a better fielder than Munaf but I don't see myself getting the callup. If you really find fielding that important, drop Patel for Raina or Kaif. I'm sure we'll all agree that his role as third seamer is far more important than saving a few runs in the field though so that most certainly won't be happening. Trying to pick someone who can do both roles but not as well as other candidates is very Fletcher-esque really - does not yield good results.

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Singh is a pretty decent bowler. His record is pretty good and he deserves a shot. I'm pretty sure he fields better than Munaf, and probably be more useful with the bat.

If Munaf doesn't learn to field a little better and get fit, I would pick singh over Munaf for the two home series later on in the month and start of feb.